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1.5.4 Ideal Worlds and EthicsVersion 1.0 October 2022Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â (Previous Version)
Many people believe implicitly, without question, that a purely material world cannot have values. Therefore, if we do live in a world where there are values, they must come from some ideal world. For many people, this is the reason they think there is an ideal world as well as the material world. In this discussion we put aside our belief that there is no God (see Chapter 1.3 on Theology), because many people think God defines what is good, or God issues commands because they are good.
Traditional theists assume that God is good. In fact God may be supremely good, or omnibenevolent. God is also, some say, all knowing (omniscient) and all powerful (omnipotent). Even if God is not all these three things, He/She is pretty close. Therefore, they say, we can accept that any commandments, rules or instructions God gives us must also be good. So perhaps what God tells us to do is what goodness is. The problem is that this position involves circular logic. If goodness is defined by God’s commands, then we cannot say that God is good. It would be like saying God is what God says. It is circular. If we can say that God is good, without referring to God’s commands, then we must have some other way to work out what is good. There is no need to say Good is only what God commands – because God commands them – because we already have an independent way to work out what is good. On a slightly different tack, perhaps God issues commands only because they are good. But how can we know if this is true? We still need to be able to work out for ourselves whether individual commands are good, and we still need to work out whether God is good, so we still have to be ablew to know what is good independently of God and God’s commands. So we must consider each of the Gods’ commandments and assess for ourselves whether or not they are good. And many of the commandments from the various sacred texts are NOT good. There are many commands in the Jewish Tanakh, the Old Testament part of the Christian Bible, that should not be followed. The book of Exodus, chapter 20 and thereabouts, says the penalty for working on the Sabbath is death. It is stated clearly and repeatedly. The Sabbath is Saturday or Sunday, depending on who you talk to. Serious orthodox Jews and Christians do not work on the Sabbath. Jesus advised people to follow the Ten Commandments, which include the rule to not work on the Sabbath. Taken literally, this means nurses, doctors and emergency services personnel who work on the Sabbath should be put to death. At least they have a good excuse, because they are helping other people. But what about supermarket workers, hospitality workers, entertainers and all the others who work on the Sabbath. Many of these workers get higher pay – penalty rates – for working on the Sabbath. They not only break the rule but profit highly from doing so!! Should they be put to death? Obviously all people, really ALL people, do not take this literally. Even orthodox Jews and Christians do not go about the place murdering non-believers who worked on the Sabbath. ALL of us know that would be bad. ALL of us know what is or is not good in this situation. Our sense of what is good does not come from God(s) or from God’s commandments. Multiple examples of bad commands in religious texts exist in all traditional religions. As a final point, in REALigion, a Reasonable Global Way, we believe God does not exist. So these debates are actually beside the point. We discuss them only because many people do believe in God. We summarize the conclusions we can reasonably come to on these issues as follows: 1.5.4  We can’t say that goodness is what God commands. Nor can we claim that God only issues commands that are good. In either case, we need some way to work out what is good independently of God and God’s commands.          So it is not reasonable to rely on God or God’s commands to work out which behaviour is acceptable or good, and which is not. We need some other way.  more
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